The Avalyn Digest

Today's Topics:
	 Re: rachel similarities
	 Re: rachel similarities
	 Re: what a "little bird" told me ... ;-D
	 Re: rachel similarities
	 Re: rachel similarities
	 Re: why only females?
	 Moose & Idaho
	 Re: Moose
	 Re: rachel similarities
	 Re: Jesus and Mary Chain at Irving Plaza 7/15
	 Re: rachel similarities
	 Re: rachel similarities
	 Re: rachel similarities
	 My CD collection
	 Re: rachel similarities
	 Re: Jesus and Mary Chain at Irving Plaza 7/15
	 Re: Moose

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 08:18:58 -0400
From: "Mark Stancombe" 
Subject: Re: rachel similarities

> I am so dissapointed...  As i was gazing at the inside mini-cover for 
> Souvlaki yesterday, I must say that my conclusion is the exact opposite 
> of yours.  Rachel is by no means an astounding beauty, and gillian 
> anderson, well, just is. 

Rachell Goswell, to me, is just a hot little red head...I wouldn't judge
her by the photos in the Souvlaki booklet because she is absolutely caked
in white face paint (or something - or it looks like it in the "alternates"
that were never used for the final layout...) Rachel made me like redheads
- especially with that chin length hair cut - absolutely
gorgeous...(slobber, slobber...)I apologise that I am indeed male and
notice these sorts of things...(sorry to offend any if I have...)

Sincerely, Sillabyss...

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 09:21:49 -0500 (CDT)
From: "jvan@bcm.tmc.edu" 
Subject: Re: rachel similarities

 did anyone ever see the pic of Rachel posing with
 an M-60 machine gun (!) in Select Magazine , circa the
 release of Souvlaki? Wow.
 

On Mon, 20 Jul 1998, Mark Stancombe wrote:

> > I am so dissapointed...  As i was gazing at the inside mini-cover for 
> > Souvlaki yesterday, I must say that my conclusion is the exact opposite 
> > of yours.  Rachel is by no means an astounding beauty, and gillian 
> > anderson, well, just is. 
> 
> Rachell Goswell, to me, is just a hot little red head...I wouldn't judge
> her by the photos in the Souvlaki booklet because she is absolutely caked
> in white face paint (or something - or it looks like it in the "alternates"
> that were never used for the final layout...) Rachel made me like redheads
> - especially with that chin length hair cut - absolutely
> gorgeous...(slobber, slobber...)I apologise that I am indeed male and
> notice these sorts of things...(sorry to offend any if I have...)
> 
> Sincerely, Sillabyss...

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 10:36:08 -0400
From: "Tom Richards" 
Subject: Re: what a "little bird" told me ... ;-D

Idaho is one of the "Slowcore" bands. They are from Los Angeles and have
been around for about 6 or 7 years. They have had numerous member changes
and the only consistant member is Jeff Martin. Their 3 full length albums
are Year after Year ('93), This Way Out ('94 or '95 I dont remember which)
and Three Sheets to the Wind ('96). They all have a heavy, morose, slow
tempo feel to them. Similair to C-clamp or Low with a more pronounced "rock"
side. I enjoy a lot of their stuff but I could see how many people wouldn't.
All 3 albums are fairly different (because of different members) but I would
have to recommend This Way Out to start with....

Tom

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 09:56:59 +0000
From: "wade@tapehouse.com" 
Subject: Re: rachel similarities

can someone post that picture?  Or do I have to drool at text!

wade

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 11:54:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: professor plum 
Subject: Re: rachel similarities

a photo can make or break a person's looks, you know.  if you've ever seen
a slowdive video boot on one of their good nights, you'd know that rachel
is quite a beaut!  there is much more to beauty (visual even) than can be
captured by a still photograph -- a moving picture does a better job but
is still no substitute for interacting with the person.

all this aside, this is a dumb topic and furthermore kind of insulting to
rachel and others in her position.  why aren't male musicians in the
public eye equally scrutinized for their looks as female ones are?  it's
pretty ridiculous.

; e.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 11:13:55 -0500
From: o_o_o 
Subject: Re: why only females?

well, email lists are usually guy-biased, as is the entire internet.  this
is not to say that women and female opinions are not welcome, it is just a
fact that right now the internet is more men than women.  Every poll I've
ever seen bears this out.  The galaxie 500 list just finished a poll, and I
think the results were something like 90% men.  couple that with the fact
that most statistics say only 10% of the population is homosexual, and you
end up with a huge majority of heterosexual men online, who like it or not
prefer female beauty to male.  and as all seinfeld fans know, men=bad
naked, women=good naked.  Also, from my experience, more men than women are
into indie music.  I know that's a big generalization, but again, I think
statistics would bear that out.  most shows I go to  have a male majority,
though not as lopsided as the internet.
I've met very few women with musical tastes even remotely similar to mine,
and when I did meet one, I married her.  and I would be remiss in my duty
as a husband if I didn't point out that while rachel is pretty (I've seen
her in person as well as in photos), my wife is more so, and smarter than
me, which is a big plus.  It's cliche, of course, but beauty is more than
appearances, and while rachel seems to hold her own in interviews, I've
never had a conversation with her, and would be hard pressed to guess if
she is intelligent and witty, though I'd hope so.  that said, if she posed
for a men's magazine would I buy it?  you bet.


At 11:54 20-07-98 -0400, you wrote:
> all this aside, this is a dumb topic and furthermore kind of insulting to
> rachel and others in her position.  why aren't male musicians in the
> public eye equally scrutinized for their looks as female ones are?  it's
> pretty ridiculous.
>
> ; e.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 18:20:05 +0200
From: Jorge Palomar 
Subject: Moose & Idaho

Hi:

Moose are greeeeeeeat!
They have three albums so far and a bunch of fantastic eps. Their first lp
is called "XYZ" and is one of the best pop albums of the last 10 years or
so. "HONEY BEE", their second one is also pretty good. I haven't heard
their third one -"LIVE A LITTLE, LOVE A LOT"- yet, but I am sure is also
worth listening. Buy "xyz" -published by Hut Records- and you'll get
heaven; it's full of fantastic melodies, beautiful details and songs to fly
with. No drones, but...

Idaho had a quite good lp -"YEAR AFTER YEAR"- preceded by "The palms ep".
Bedhead meets American Music Club? Maybe. Their second album, the
disappointing "THIS WAY OUT", had the same sound but half of the magic. I
know they have a third one but,...
By the way, one of their members was the boyfriend of Alison Shaw from Cranes.

Love

Jorge

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 11:27:48 -0500
From: o_o_o 
Subject: Re: Moose

I've only heard one moose song, but it is very good.  it was on one of the
indie top 20 compilations.  maybe called don't ever leave?  I'd love to
know if any of their other songs are as good as that one.

At 18:20 20-07-98 +0200, you wrote:
> Hi:
>
> Moose are greeeeeeeat!
> They have three albums so far and a bunch of fantastic eps. Their first lp
> is called "XYZ" and is one of the best pop albums of the last 10 years or
> so. "HONEY BEE", their second one is also pretty good. I haven't heard
> their third one -"LIVE A LITTLE, LOVE A LOT"- yet, but I am sure is also
> worth listening. Buy "xyz" -published by Hut Records- and you'll get
> heaven; it's full of fantastic melodies, beautiful details and songs to fly
> with. No drones, but...
> Love
>
> Jorge

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 12:07:05 -0500 (EST)
From: bLenDER 
Subject: Re: rachel similarities

> all this aside, this is a dumb topic and furthermore kind of insulting to
> rachel and others in her position.  why aren't male musicians in the
> public eye equally scrutinized for their looks as female ones are?  it's
> pretty ridiculous.

well, both sexes are scrutinized.  In commercial music, guys have to have
some kind of sexy look or atleast be unique looking.  Think of any
charting band.  Some or all of the members maintain some kind of style or
look.  Sure, some bands slip through the cracks (blues traveler), but for
the most part, most bands have some kind or amount of style.  

Now you have more music oriented scenes.  Where mass commercial sales are
not the immedeate goal by the record companies.  Basically, where
consumption is not the desired result, but an understanding of the
artist's music.  Rachel happens to be attractive, but even if she was
hideously ugly I think we'd all still like slowdive provided her voice was
the same, and she made the same musical contributions.  

I know neil played nice rickenbackers and rachel had a nice thinline tele.
Beautiful guitars.  But if they used Hondos and Squires, so long as they
made nice music, I wouldn't care.  

I think looks are scrutinized by both sexes, and to many beople seeing a
female bassist, drummer, or guitarist is still a "weird" think.  But the
people who are concerned about this matter are probably less into the
music and more into the look and image, and will be one of the first to
ditch this band and jump on to the next big or cool bad.  Dare I say the
people who scrutinize over band member's looks are probably more of a
superficial music fan.  People who care about attractiveness of their fave
bands probably want more of an entertainment type show than to be
entertained and awed by something artistic and sonically unique...

later

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 12:36:15 -0500 (CDT)
From: cory <1cc5776@unixstew.tstc.edu>
Subject: Re: Jesus and Mary Chain at Irving Plaza 7/15

Yikes! you wouldn't guess that there are nice people in Texas from this 
scathing comment.  I am from Texas, and we are really nice people, I 
promise.  I also don't like 16 Deluxe, even though they are from around 
here...

On Thu, 16 Jul 1998 Catchbreez@aol.com wrote:
> 16 deluxe are fucking great
> and fuck you on the texas slam
> there are plenty of great people and bands from texas
> me being one of them
> 
> so fuck you jared
> 
> "16 Deluxe- sounds like sweet jesus except from texas.  i don't know why
> people like these guys...there are so many better bands out there.  they
> were noisy and annoying."

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 13:45:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: mike p 
Subject: Re: rachel similarities

> I know neil played nice rickenbackers and rachel had a nice thinline tele.
> Beautiful guitars.  But if they used Hondos and Squires, so long as they
> made nice music, I wouldn't care.  

thatd be cool! ..slowdive playing repainted hondos covered with stickers
and duct tape.

about grrls and music.. it's pretty nice to play in a band with at least 1
female, it keeps male members inline that might be somewhat obnoxious and
un-productive in an all guy situation. of course guys like that are not
choice band mates anyway, but it happens. thats my experience.

mike

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 13:57:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: professor plum 
Subject: Re: rachel similarities

ben, your point is well-taken, and i don't disagree -- what i was
actually getting at earlier was how the sexes aren't *equally* scrutinized
for their looks, even in proportion to the numbers of their fans of
corresponding sexual preferences.  that is, i don't think the numbers of
heterosexual males can completely account for how we treat women in the
entertainment industry.  but i'm going to stop here b/c noone wants to
read a feminist tirade, especially from me!  :)

; e.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 13:29:21 -0500 (EST)
From: bLenDER 
Subject: Re: rachel similarities

> ben, your point is well-taken, and i don't disagree -- what i was
> actually getting at earlier was how the sexes aren't *equally* scrutinized
> for their looks, even in proportion to the numbers of their fans of
> corresponding sexual preferences.  that is, i don't think the numbers of
> heterosexual males can completely account for how we treat women in the
> entertainment industry.  but i'm going to stop here b/c noone wants to
> read a feminist tirade, especially from me!  :)

agreed.
However, personally, I think the entertainment industry is about playing a
game, if you choose to participate, that is.  Most dreampop/spacerock
whatever, is on that teetering see saw of art/entertainment.  
Visuals can be entertaining and enticing, which makes money for record
companies, movie production houses, bands, actors, actresses, managers,
producers, etc.  Good music and wonderful movies also make money, but
frankly, not nearly as much as image based media.  Spice Girls, Godzilla,
Armageddon, Backstreet Boys, colorful, merceedes filled rap videos.  None
of this is art but instead, it's sheer visual entertainment.  

Everyone has appriciation for the visual sense.

The entertainment industry, in general, jsut doesn't give a shit for the
most part.  If sexism sells, they sell it.  If instantly appealing music
by young flashy men sells, they sell it.  If a creative or artistic band
like slowdive sells, they sell it.  The entertaing ment industry is not
biased, they sell what the public will buy.  And the public buys sexism,
racial stereotypes, and sometimes good innovative music.

But I stay out of the entertainment industry as much as possible.  Our
favourite bands wouldn't be know without them, however.

And I write all this as I download Radiohead MP3s.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 18:39:35
From: lynh-n@usa.net
Subject: My CD collection

Hello,
I have part of my CD collection available for sale or trade.
Here is:
* Mojave 3 (4AD, UK)
* Slowdive 'Souvlaki' (with 4 extra tracks)
* This Mortal Coil 'Filigree & Shadow' (4AD, UK)
* CD5 Pale Saints 'Throwing Back The Apple' (4AD, UK)
* Xymox 'Subsequent Pleasures' (Holland)

I am looking for:
* Cocteau Twins 'Pink Opaque'
* Slowdive 'Pygmalion'

If anyone is interested email me.

Lynh

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 14:05:01 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Gilham 
Subject: Re: rachel similarities

On Mon, 20 Jul 1998, cory wrote:

> I am so ...  As i was gazing at the inside mini-cover for 
> Souvlaki yesterday, I must say that my conclusion is the exact opposite 
> of yours.  Rachel is by no means an astounding beauty, and gillian 
> anderson, well, just is.  I'm expecting to get demolished for this 
> heretical viewpoint, but hey didn't we get scolded for talking about our 
> opinions of a females looks once before on this list.... i didn't say it...

erm, I dunno, I hate to enter into a discussion about Ms. Goswell's
appearance again; but, I've seen Rachel up-close, and to me, she is more
attractive than Gillian.  

I find the above somehow mis-guided.  Yes, Gillian is
not dis-pleasing to look at, but I would not call her an "astounding
beauty."  Both she and Rachel are pretty.  And, while it is rather petty
to make these superficial distinctions; my aesthetic sense tells me that
Rachel has the edge ... :-) 

I am as fond of Gillian and New Order as I am of Slowdive (more
really), but I just don't see the side of things as stated above :-)
They are both beautiful people, anyway. :-)

love,
Michael

PS  I've always thought Neil was a very handsome man! :-)  Surely some of
the fairer sex on here would agree? ;-)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 14:26:55 +0000
From: "wade@tapehouse.com" 
Subject: Re: Jesus and Mary Chain at Irving Plaza 7/15

To me,Tripping Daisy, started to get me into the Texas scene.

that was in high school though.

wade

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 12:20:18 -0700
From: aaron 
Subject: Re: Moose

o_o_o wrote:
> 
> I've only heard one moose song, but it is very good.  it was on one of the
> indie top 20 compilations.  maybe called don't ever leave?  I'd love to
> know if any of their other songs are as good as that one.

There's a song by Revolver called Don't Ever Leave.  That wasn't a
single though so I doubt that's what you're thinking of.  Hmm, moose's
early singles were Jack, Suzanne, and Last Night I Fell Again.  I don't
think anything after that would have made it on an indie top 20.  It was
probably Jack.  They even played that on 120 minutes US.  If you're
after that sound then try to find the first three e.p.s.

aaron

------------------------------

End of Avalyn Digest Vol.98 #105
********************************

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This page was last updated Jul 25, 1998 by Erik Söderström

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