From archive Fri Aug 21 13:23:20 MDT 1992 Subject: C.S. Friedman's "In Conquest Born" Keywords: Nebula, Hugo, Good. From: sjrapaport@watcgl.UUCP Organization: U of Waterloo, Ontario Date: 4 May 87 23:49:34 GMT At last, someone who writes like Frank Herbert would like to but never did. A book full of subtle (and not-so-subtle) manipulation, feints within feints, and quick turnabouts, lacking nothing but the self- congratulatory chapter headings that Herbert was so pleased with. I'll have to agree with Chuq on the **** rating. Friedman's universe is quite convincing, and has enough reality of its own to make character types like "Braxana'" and "Azean" useful concepts. (Heinlein says that writers with imagination and style actually create the universes they write about, on some weird plane. If he's right, there's now one more nifty universe among the 6^6^6.) The book is difficult to put down, since the action is one long crescendo from start to finish. (Sort of a literate Ravel's Bolero.) Bravo (brava?), C.S. Your audience awaits more. -steve -- ------------- | "Because I'm not left-handed either..." -The Man In Black | | Steve Rapaport, U. of Waterloo. ...!ihnp4!watmath!watcgl!sjrapaport From @asterix.liu.se,@majestix.liu.se:matoh@prefix.liu.se Tue May 26 00:33:05 1987 Received: from asterix.liu.se by obelix.liu.se; Tue, 26 May 87 00:33:05 SDT Received: from majestix.liu.se by asterix.liu.se; Tue, 26 May 87 00:19:18 +0200 Received: from prefix.liu.se by majestix.liu.se; Tue, 26 May 87 00:19:19 +0200 Received: by prefix.liu.se; Tue, 26 May 87 00:18:34 +0200 Date: Tue, 26 May 87 00:18:34 +0200 From: Mats Ohrman -exj -peter fritz Message-Id: <8705252218.AA04271@prefix.liu.se> To: mats@obelix.liu.se Status: R Path: liuida!enea!mcvax!seismo!husc6!rutgers!ames!ptsfa!hoptoad!academ!killer!elg From: elg@killer.UUCP (Eric Green) Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf-lovers Subject: Review: _In Conquest Born (*SPOILER?*) Keywords: C.S. Friedman Message-ID: <916@killer.UUCP> Date: 21 May 87 03:39:00 GMT Organization: The Unix(tm) Connection, Dallas, Texas Lines: 41 Review: _In Conquest Born_, by C.S. Friedman: The first thing you notice is that this book has two different front covers: One with a white-and-blue clad female, and one with a black-clad male holding a sword. Which leads you to the next picture: That of two societies, in perpetual conflict, occupying moral extremes, built by two different types of conquest: one, by the conquest of their fellow tribesmen via ruthlessness, duplicity, power, and beauty, and the other, by escape from oppressors and the conquest of a hostile planet by changing themselves to fit the planet, instead of changing the planet to fit themselves. This is a large book, and sometimes, plot elements seem to get lost in the wind, or perhaps just forgotten from the memory of weary readers :-). But that really is nothing. The thing that drives this book is NOT the plot, but rather, the characters. There are two main protagonists, whose character is finely sketched in the first few pages of the book, not by the usual bludgeon of your universal-narrator speechifying, but rather, by bringing in scenes from their life that helped shape them into the people that they are. There is also a large cast of secondary characters, who are no less finely drawn as the book passes, although not in such detail. It makes the "suspension of disbelief" very easy, to see these characters acting, in general, in a manner fitting their unique personality. _In Conquest Born_ is not perfect. Both plot and characterization sometimes have flaws, although there are no gaping holes. It is not a five-star rating of "a classic". But still, it is a Very Good Book, especially from writer who apparently has little experience, and you could do worse. In fact, after finishing the book, I almost immediately started re-reading it. The only other two books I've done THAT to are _Dune_, and _Ender's Game_.... which puts it pretty high on the chart. I only hope that the sequel isn't as sappy as _Speaker to the Dead_, because I'd much like to read further works by this author. Rating: Four stars: ****+ Very Good, Much Above Average. -- Eric Green elg%usl.CSNET CS student, University of SW Louisiana {cbosgd,ihnp4}!killer!elg Apprentice Haquer, Bayou Telecommunications Snail Mail P.O. Box 92191 BBS phone #: 318-984-3854 300/1200 baud Lafayette, LA 70509 I disclaim my existence, and yours, too. From rec.arts.sf.written Tue Aug 11 10:17:15 1992 Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written Path: herkules.sssab.se!isy!liuida!sunic!mcsun!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!wupost!csus.edu!netcom.com!dani From: dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig) Subject: Black Sun Rising Message-ID: <5hzmbt.dani@netcom.com> Date: Sat, 08 Aug 92 08:28:07 GMT Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest) Lines: 24 C.S. Friedman made the mistake of starting her science-fiction career with "In Conquest Born", so anything she subsequently writes is held to an almost-impossibly high standard. Her second book, "The Madness Season", was quite good, but a common reaction to it was disappointment -- It was no "In Conquest Born". Neither is her new fantasy trilogy, the first book of which is out in hardcover. Not that it's bad. "Black Sun Rising" is a highly competent quest fantasy. This book introduces us to Friedman's world, presents an interesting system of magic, introduces some or most of the important characters, and puts those characters through an adventure which, though self-contained, serves to set up the rest of the trilogy. Sound familiar? It should. The key word, again, is 'competent'. The writing is good, the magic is original in theory if not in practice, the book is worth reading. But don't expect anything ground-breaking. ----- Dani Zweig dani@netcom.com 'T is with our judgements as our watches, none Go alike, yet each believes his own --Alexander Pope From rec.arts.sf.reviews Tue Oct 4 14:44:27 1994 Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.reviews Path: news.ifm.liu.se!liuida!sunic!uunet!europa.eng.gtefsd.com!howland.reston.ans.net!swrinde!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!decwrl!netcomsv!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!postmodern.com!not-for-mail From: lpb@ccs.neu.edu (L. P. Burka) Subject: Review: _Black Sun Rising_, C.S. Friedman Message-ID: <199409222356.TAA25619@everest.ccs.neu.edu> Followup-To: rec.arts.sf.written Sender: mcb@postmodern.com (Michael C. Berch) Organization: The Internet Date: Mon, 3 Oct 1994 18:56:50 GMT Approved: mcb@postmodern.com (rec.arts.sf.reviews moderator) Lines: 86 [Spoilers: There's probably one in here somewhere.] I didn't like this book. This isn't to say it's a bad book--someone liked it enough to recommend it to me, and it has an interesting premise, even if the execution is somewhat poor. The book is just sort of lame. The dark and enticing Michael Whelan cover pic just makes it that much more disappointing. The premise of _Black Sun Rising_ is that a cold-sleep colony ship landed upon the planet Erna about 1200 years ago. The planet is convulsed by seismic activity and occult energies that the colonists call the _fae_. These energies may be shaped by by those who are born with or acquire through study the talents to direct its fickle powers. The fae is useful to augment technological devices as well (in this, the book resembles _The Practice Effect_ by Brin). However, the fae is also responsive to human fears. A sorcerer who isn't sufficiently focused, or who has doubts, may cause this turmoil to manifest as physical demons that need to be hunted down and killed. Over 1200 years, the planet has acquired lots of demons, as well as gods, benign or malevolent. Large-scale attempts to tame the fae have tended to backfire, and some of the humans who tried it became nastier than anything they fought. The kinds of fae most responsive to demonic fallout are also the most sensitive to sunlight, so they are only thick enough to be dangerous in the dark, when the sun, the galactic core, and the three moons aren't overhead to disperse them. Now let's cut to the chase. What didn't I like about this book? For one, the characters are uninteresting. There isn't much distinction between their voices, though they each have separate passions (or lusts). In fact, I keep getting the feeling that the characters were supposed to be in a rehashed Viet Nam screenplay and got lost on the way over. When the author attempts to subject the characters to the pains and sufferings, physical and spiritual, that are supposed to provide 'growth' (and incidentally titillate those of us who like reading bloodthirsty, sadistic stuff), the tortures don't come across as pruriently interesting, sensual or disturbing, only repetitive. The characters aren't solid enough to bleed convincingly. The dialog is also repetitive, to the point that I kept wondering if the author accidentally leaned on the cut and paste button a few times and dropped the same anguished philosophical debates subsequent pages without noticing. This may also be a sign of poor editing. [Incidentally, I found one obvious typo, 'then' for 'than.' I suppose one typo in 600 pages is pretty good, but by then I was disenchanted enough to want to nit-pick about it.] Even the curses are lame: "The Hunter can take his Forest and shove it," Damien said sharply, "How do we get to this black fortress of his?" They were silent for a moment, stunned by the force of the blasphemy. They're stunned. I'm bored. The prose style is also buried in gratuitous adverbs, and Friedman suffers from that deadly disease of science fiction writers everywhere, namely the use of earth technology terms and metaphors that mesh poorly with the pseudo-renaissance atmosphere. In 1200 years, the colonists should be able to come up with something else. For most of the last 1/3 of the book, I was reading the first sentence of every paragraph and skipping the rest, and I don't think I missed anything important. I would like to address some annoying structural flaws. Interesting characters that appear at the beginning and look like they're going to be significant don't show up again. One of the big villains of the piece doesn't turn out to be anyone we know already, and doesn't have a personality beyond villainy. Important issues are left unresolved. We know this is because the author must be planning a sequel, but I keep wondering if clumsiness is the real cause of these flaws. And if this is sequel fever, it takes a lot of responsibility for the weak ending. OK, so I finished it. Maybe now I'll go throw it across the room. %A Friedman, C. S. %T Black Sun Rising %I DAW %C New York %D 1991 %G ISBN 0-88677-527-2 %P 586pp %O $5.99 From rec.arts.sf.reviews Tue Sep 24 22:00:24 1996 Path: news.ifm.liu.se!news.lejonet.se!mcevans.tip.net.!newsfeed.tip.net!newsfeed.sunet.se!news01.sunet.se!sunic!02-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!01-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!swidir.switch.ch!in2p3.fr!univ-lyon1.fr!jussieu.fr!math.ohio-state.edu!cs.utexas.edu!nntp.primenet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!bloom-beacon.mit.edu!news.media.mit.edu!usenet From: aahz@netcom.com (Mean Green Dancing Machine) Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.reviews Subject: Review: _In Conquest Born_ by C.S. Friedman Followup-To: rec.arts.sf.written Date: 16 Sep 1996 11:52:38 -0400 Organization: The Cat & Dragon Lines: 54 Sender: wex@tinbergen.media.mit.edu (Graystreak) Approved: wex@media.mit.edu Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: tinbergen.media.mit.edu Keywords: author= Aahz X-Newsreader: (ding) Gnus v0.94 _In Conquest Born_, by C.S. Friedman Reviewed by Aahz, copyright 1996 Star-spanning galactic empire! *Two* star-spanning galactic empires! Spaceships! Sword fights! (oops, that last a slight exaggeration) And, to top it off, instead of a protagonist (or multiple protagonists), we have two antagonists. With that, Friedman turns the traditional space opera on its head, focusing with such a fine balance on two characters who hate each other that neither gets your full sympathy. Or, perhaps, despite their awesome talents, both are at the mercy of forces so much larger than them that they both merit full sympathy. Like all space opera, the basic plot is simple: two galactic empires have been at each other's throat for centuries and have reached a semi-stable stalemate. In each empire, a leader rises who forces a new, final level of confrontation. It's the details that make _In Conquest Born_ stand out: the fully fleshed-out main characters, the realistic supporting characters, the conflicting societies, and the intertwined stories. _In Conquest Born_ is Friedman's first SF novel (and may well be zir first published work), yet it shows the polish of a neurotic regard for detail at all levels; it is the best first work I have ever seen, and I would rate it easily on a par with _A Fire Upon the Deep_. Even now, after re-reading 8 or 10 times, the ending still has enough power to bring a lump to my throat. Despite the attention paid to character development, Friedman includes enough technological detail to keep most hard-SF fans happy. Zir descriptions of various societies are fascinating, though without the alien feeling Vernor Vinge and C.J. Cherryh achieve at their best. The superb cover by Michael Whelan adds to the dramatic tension. All in all, this is a book that belongs on your shelf, for you'll probably want to read it several times. %A Friedman, C.S. %T In Conquest Born %I Daw %C New York %D 1986 %G ISBN 0-88677-198-6 %P 511pp %O paperback --- Aahz (@netcom.com) From rec.arts.sf.reviews Tue Aug 24 16:11:19 1999 Path: news.ifm.liu.se!news.lth.se!feed2.news.luth.se!luth.se!newsfeed.direct.ca!newsfeed.berkeley.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!info.usuhs.mil!cs.umd.edu!hecate.umd.edu!sipb-server-1.mit.edu!senator-bedfellow.mit.edu!usenet From: "Aaron M. Renn" Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.reviews Subject: Review: This Alien Shore by C.S. Friedman Followup-To: rec.arts.sf.written Date: 09 Aug 1999 13:34:41 -0400 Organization: GNU's Not Unix! Lines: 77 Sender: wex@tinbergen.media.mit.edu Approved: wex@media.mit.edu Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: tinbergen.media.mit.edu To: wex@media.mit.edu X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Xref: news.ifm.liu.se rec.arts.sf.reviews:2419 This Alien Shore by C.S. Friedman Review Copyright (c) 1999 Aaron M. Renn Conclusion: Worth Reading But Very Uneven This Alien Shore started off like a house on fire but then flamed out. There was a lot I liked in there, but also a lot not to like. I do a better job of bitching about what I don't like than raving about what I do, so this review will focus on the negative. Please keep in mind that I actually found the book rather balanced between the two. First an overview. A young girl named Jasimia is awakened and told to flee the space station she's always called home. Mysterious enemies are after her because she possesses deep, dark secrets they want, of which Jasimia herself is not aware. Meanwhile, the Gueran outpilot Guild, which controls all intersteller travel, is looking for the source of a mysterious virus that is killing their precious pilots. If you don't think these two plotlines have much to do with each other besides the possibility that Jasimia is the source of the virus, you're right. These bifurcated plot threads don't converge until the end, and then in a way that is contrived. It made me feel like I was reading two separate books set in the same universe. Both of them started out in a way that really piqued my interest, and I kept waiting for them to connect, but they never really did. The story's ending was very anticlimactic. One thread is resolved in an almost offhand manner, as if Friedman realized one day, "Gee, it's page 500 and I'm not anywhere closer to being done than when I started." The other is never fully completed, setting us up for a possible sequel. I was very unhappy. The other main thing that bothered me was Friedman's description of the "hackers" in her universe. These are (mostly) young kids who know the outernet and computers inside and out and love to break into various nodes causing mischief, but normally little real damage. Her impression of the hacker ethic is something straight out of the pages of 2600 Magazine. As a member of the real hacking community - people who program computers to build things, not to break in or destroy - I find that bothersome. I'm not offended, but it did sour the novel for me personally. On the other hand, the world building was intriguing. In her universe, the first generation of FTL ships caused irreversible genetic damage, turning the human spacefarers into freaks. I thought this failed the suspension of disbelief test but was interesting nevertheless. The Guerans deserve particular praise. Instead of physical deformities, they all suffer from various forms of mental illness. It was interesting to try to figure out what disorders these people had. I recognized people with autism, obsessive/compulsive disorder, Tourette's Syndrome, and paranoid schizophrenia. Friedman also does a good job of world building. There's a lot more than what I've described above and you'll enjoy it. Some of the elements aren't that original, but insisting that everything in an SF book be that is simply unreasonable. Friedman takes her themes and elements and uses them to very good effect. The more I saw of this universe she created, the more I wanted to see. She also did a good job of creating characters I could care about and relate to. The writing was skillful as you might expect. I bought In Conquest Born when it came out and I loved it. I'm not quite sure why, but I didn't buy any other Friedman books until now. While I thought this effort fell far short of ICB, it was still a decent read, if a bit of a long one. I'm definitely willing to give her another shot to wow me, especially in light of posts I've read saying this is an uncharacteristically weak effort. %A Friedman, C.S. %T This Alien Shore %I DAW %D 1999-07 (original publication 1998-12) %G ISBN 0-88677-799-2 %P 564 pp. %0 mass market paperback, US$6.99 Reviewed on 1999-08-01 -- Aaron M. Renn (arenn@urbanophile.com) http://www.urbanophile.com/arenn/