From cnishida@netcom.com Sat Oct 28 05:36:04 1995 Received: from netcom14.netcom.com by soyokaze.biosci.ohio-state.edu (8.7.1/1.950110) id FAA24639; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 05:36:01 GMT Received: by netcom14.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id WAA09181; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 22:31:50 -0700 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 22:31:49 -0700 (PDT) From: "Craig H. Nishida" Subject: Re: [MB-MANGA] 1.3 (1/4) To: MB-trans ML Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Paul writes: P> On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Jeanne writes: J> On Thu, 26 Oct 1995, Akira writes: A> On Thu, 26 Oct 1995, Paul writes: P> J> For what they're worth, here's my comments on 1.3 (and I'm desperately J> trying to find volume 2 - it's out of stock at both Nikaku and UCI): Wow. Who bought up all the stock? --------------------------------------------------- P> > 83-2 P> > Rumi/Chiyako: P> > See you later. Itte-rassha--i P> P> Have a nice day? I dunno...just more 'parent-ish' A> A> I'd stick with the original. These parents aren't your typical parents. --------------------------------------------------- P> isn't it komOtte? I think that was the word for 'stay in', sa opposed to P> 'komatte' which is as you have, troubled. Oops. ===> 85-1 Miki: ____ (Yesterday, I passed on (kinou wa YUUGE pasu shite dinner, stayed in my yesterday (T) dinner pass-(and) room and avoided seeing him...) HEYA ni komotte Au no in-room stay-in-(and) meeting/seeing YOkechatta kedo) avoided-(finality) but --------------------------------------------------- J> >85-3 J> >[Back to reality. View pans back. Miki is dressed in her school uniform. J> > She blushes furiously, clapping both hands to her cheeks.] J> >Miki dramatic FX: J> > kaaa J> J> Isn't the "crow-kaa" one of those foreshadowing your 'doom' type effects? Not necessarily that much. --------------------------------------------------- 86-1 narration: Well, he thinks I was maa MUkou wa kotchi ga asleep... well the-other-party (T) this-way (S) NEte-ta to OMOtte-ru n da was-sleeping is-thinking-that (explan) shi and-besides A> A> NEte-ta is "was sleeping", so how about "thinks I was sleeping..." ? P> P> sure It's the same thing. --------------------------------------------------- P> > 86-1 P> > narration: P> > So I can pretend like I SHIran KAO shite-reba ii P> > don't know... not-know face if-am-making okay P> > P> > n da kedo sa... P> > (explan) but P> P> ...but? A> A> Sure. Something like "like I don't know, but..." maybe? A> I don't think you need the "like" here. Nah. P> either. but the iinda kedo is 'so it'd be ok if i pretended [like] I P> didn't know'. --------------------------------------------------- A> 87-1 A> Yuu: A> > They left for work a long tokku ni KAISHA Itta yo A> > time ago. long-ago went-to-office A> A> For some reason I'd prefer "awhile ago". I only use "a long time ago" A> in conversation for things which happened at least a few hours before. Prefer line as-is. --------------------------------------------------- P> I think this is more of a statement - ok, maybe rhet-q too. Maybe toss P> in a 'it's nice that we're so close to school' A> A> Hmm... something like "It's nice that we're so close to school -- we A> can take it easy, can't we." maybe? P> P> something like that. That's no good. It duplicates the as both "it's nice that" and the "can" in "can take it easy". I prefer the original over "It's nice that we're so close to school". Basically because it blurs the . ===> 87-1 Yuu: We're close to school, ore-tachi wa GAKKOU CHIKAi kara so we can take it easy, we (T) school from-close-by right. RAKU de ii yo na at-ease okay (rhet) --------------------------------------------------- P> > 87-2 P> > caption: [Jin] P> > Even now--a bank clerk kore demo GINKOUIN P> > P> > caption: [Youji] ___ P> > For now--a company man ichiou SHOUSHA man P> P> the 'kore demo' is the same type of kore-demo used when Meiko was trying to P> comfort Miki. He's not exactly putting himself down but basically he's P> saying that 'even i am' or 'altho what you see isn't much, i still am P> an actual bank clerk, believe it or not'. that's probly making it too strong, P> but that's the direction we're going. even-now doesn't do it right. P> P> ichiou also goes hand in hand with it, and makes it a little bit stronger. P> It's kinda like 'technically, i really am' or somethin glike that. i P> dont think technically is the right spin tho. A> A> "Thus far -- a bank clerk" A> "Currently -- a company man" ? P> P> I wouldn't do the first one. And currently is more a time-reference to P> me, and I don't really think ichiou is a reference to time directly. I P> dunno. maybe someone else can explain it better :) You mean like: Apparently, a bank clerk. Pretty much a company man. ??? --------------------------------------------------- P> > 87-2 P> > caption: [Rumi] ________ P> > Works for a cosmetics KESHOUHIN me--ka-- KINMU P> > maker cosmetics maker work/service P> > P> > caption: [Chiyako] ________ P> > Works for a maker of YOUSHU me--ka-- KINMU P> > Western-style liquor foreign-liquor maker work/service P> P> Isn't kinmu in-chrage? A> A> Hmm... something like "manager" perhaps? Not in my dictionary. A> I think "cosmetics manufacturer" and Okay. ===> 87-2 caption: [Rumi] ________ Works for a cosmetics KESHOUHIN me--ka-- KINMU manufacturer cosmetics maker work/service A> "Western-style liquor brewer (producer)" are more appropriate A> appellations of the companies... Dunno about this one. --------------------------------------------------- P> > 87-2 P> > newspaper: P> > Daily Newspaper MAINICHI SHIMBUN P> P> Hey, I used to read that paper. Yes, there's an actual paper by that name. Footnoted. --------------------------------------------------- A> 88-3 A> Miki: A> > Why are you handing me nande terebi RAN dake yokosu no? A> > only the TV section? why just-TV-section give A> A> "Why only give me the TV section?" ? A> He's already handed her the section, right? Let's not split nits. I'd still say it that way, since he's only just handed it to her. --------------------------------------------------- 88-5 caption with arrow pointing at Miki's head: Because they're direct atatte-iru no de iikaesenai hits, she can't talk back. is-hitting (nom) because can't-talk-back P> P> direct-hit is a bit much. he's right, so i A> A> I don't think so -- he's characterized her dead-on, hasn't he? P> P> I dont remember. Just this line in particular tho - attete-iru is just P> 'you're right' or something. how right you are, whether direct-hit or P> just sorta in the ballpark...not sure I did this based on her reaction. You don't go speechless, lacking for a retort, if you weren't nailed right between the eyes. --------------------------------------------------- J> >89-1 J> >[He holds one of the jars.] J> >Yuu: J> > There's none. nee yo J> > = not-have J> J> I suggest: "It's empty." A> A> Hmm... Here I'd use the original because it isn't specified whether the A> jar is empty or whether there's no jar... P> P> true, but i think the jar's just empty, isn't it? The original line is correct. What Yuu hauls out is the jar of *marmalade*. There is no empty jar of apricot jam, which is what Miki originally asked for. There is no such jar at all. --------------------------------------------------- A> 89-2 A> Miki: [off] A> > I don't like that very anmari SUki ja nai... A> > much... -so-much like am-not A> A> Replace "that" with "it"... Nah. We don't know that she's holding it quite yet. --------------------------------------------------- P> > 89-2 P> > Miki: [off] P> > Bu-u-ut. The skins... datte~~~~ NIGAi n da mon P> > They're bitter... but bitter is-the-reason P> > P> > KAWA no toko... P> > skin 's place P> P> Sigh. Anyone remember that one British-made orange marmalade? Can't P> buy it around here anymore. I'd reconigze the name if I heard it. Sigh. P> It was pretty famous. Tree somethin? I dunno, maybe not. Well, there's some English-looking one sold at Trader Joe's. Want me to snag one for ya? ^_^ Tree?!? --------------------------------------------------- J> >89-5 J> >[A blank panel.] J> >Miki: [off] J> > Really, even though you have honto wa suggoku NIGAi toko J> > some awfully bitter points, true (T) awfully bitter points J> > everyone's unaware and J> > being deceived by the aru no ni J> > sweetness on the surface. have even-though J> > J> > minna uwabe no AMAsa ni J> > everyone the-surface 's by-sweet J> > J> > damasarete KIzuite-nai no J> > are-deceived-(and) aren't-aware J> J> I suggest: "It's true, everyone's unaware of your awfully bitter points, and J> are deceived by the sweetness on the surface." Uh, no. That scrambles the two clauses something terrible. You've got "everyone's unaware" from the 2nd clause and "(of your) awfully bitter points" from the first. A> For some reason I think the mention of the bitter points should come before A> the "everyone's unaware" bit, as it does in the Japanese original... A> A> Well, my suggestion for this line goes: A> "...bitter points, everyone's deceived by your superficial sweetness, and A> unaware of them." ? Unaware of "them"? I don't think it's that everyone is unaware of the bitter points, but that they are unaware Yuu's deceiving them. ===> 89-5 Miki: [off] Really, even though you have honto wa suggoku NIGAi toko some awfully bitter points, true (T) awfully bitter points unknowingly, everyone's being deceived by the aru no ni sweetness on the surface. have even-though minna uwabe no AMAsa ni everyone the-surface 's by-sweet damasarete KIzuite-nai no are-deceived-(and) aren't-aware --------------------------------------------------- A> 90-3 A> Yuu: ________ A> > One who's only prickly piripiri karai bakka no A> > and peppery. burning/prickly peppery only (nom) A> A> How about "Thoroughly prickly and peppery -- " ? Not quite the right spin, I think. Yours makes it a matter of degree, whereas I think the means that she's nothing but. A> I don't think you need the "one who's" here... I prefer it in. --------------------------------------------------- A> 90-4 A> Miki: A> > ......!! ......!! A> A> sweat-bead alert! ^_^ Eh? That's on her head, not in the speech bubble. --------------------------------------------------- P> nani-ka-no...what happened yesterday was some sort/kind of accident A> A> That sounds pretty good... "some sort of accident"... Sure. ===> 91-2 Miki: (...... What happened (...... kinou no koto wa NANI-ka yesterday was some sort about-yesterday (T) something of accident.) ________ no machigai datta n da) 's accident was (explan) --------------------------------------------------- A> "I'll make (I'll act) as if it never happened!" ? A> There should be some way to insert the "ni suru" without being A> unduly wordy... P> P> yah, that'd b emore accurate Hm. Okay. ===> 91-3 Miki: [off] (I'll make as if it never (nakatta koto ni suru!!) happened!!) wasn't-there to-decide-to-do --------------------------------------------------- P> it could be specialty tokui. it oculd also just be 'very good at' ===> 92-3 Chiyako: [off] If it's math you're doing, SUUGAKU dattara YOUJI ga TOKUI yo Youji's very good at it. math if-it-is (S) forte --------------------------------------------------- A> 92-3 A> Miki: [off] A> > Then maybe I'll do just jaa sou shiyo_ ka naa A> > that. then like-that shall-do I-wonder A> A> I don't think you need the "just" there... P> P> eitehr I'm leaving it in. --------------------------------------------------- Craig From scotty@skuld.corp.sgi.com Sat Oct 28 05:46:25 1995 Received: from sgigate.sgi.com by soyokaze.biosci.ohio-state.edu (8.7.1/1.950110) id FAA24653; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 05:46:23 GMT Received: from skuld.corp.sgi.com by sgigate.sgi.com via ESMTP (950911.SGI.8.6.12.PATCH825/940406.SGI) for <@sgigate.sgi.com:mboy-trans@soyokaze.biosci.ohio-state.edu> id WAA27246; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 22:43:39 -0700 Received: by skuld.corp.sgi.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id WAA01492; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 22:43:31 -0700 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 22:43:31 -0700 From: scotty@skuld.corp.sgi.com (Scott Henry) Message-Id: <199510280543.WAA01492@skuld.corp.sgi.com> To: mboy-trans@soyokaze.biosci.ohio-state.edu Subject: MBoy manga In-Reply-To: <199510272057.UAA24229@soyokaze.biosci.ohio-state.edu> References: <199510272057.UAA24229@soyokaze.biosci.ohio-state.edu> Reply-To: scotty@sgi.com >>>>> "J" == Jason Ho writes: J> Hi, does anyone know where in the San Francisco Bay Area still J> carry MBoy manga? Kinokuniya doesn't, and UCI won't restock for a month, J> and I don't know whether Nikaku carries them but their shipping policies J> suck big time. Does anyone know where else I can get them. Thank you for J> your time. The San Jose Kinokinuya carried MBoy manga the last time I was in there... What's wrong with Nikaku's shipping policy? They do have them. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= More Important Drivel from: Scott Henry / Just Another Anime & Manga Fan when virtual just won't do-- http://reality.sgi.com/employees/scotth/ From cnishida@netcom.com Sat Oct 28 07:53:35 1995 Received: from netcom13.netcom.com by soyokaze.biosci.ohio-state.edu (8.7.1/1.950110) id HAA24752; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 07:53:33 GMT Received: by netcom13.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id AAA14706; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 00:49:20 -0700 Date: Sat, 28 Oct 1995 00:49:19 -0700 (PDT) From: "Craig H. Nishida" Subject: Re: [MB-MANGA] 1.3 (2/4) To: MB-trans ML Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Paul writes: P> On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Jeanne writes: J> On Thu, 26 Oct 1995, Akira writes: A> On Thu, 26 Oct 1995, Paul writes: P> A> 93-1 A> Miki: A> > You're an expert at YOUJI-san OSHIe-KATA JOUZU-- A> > teaching, Youji-san. way-of-teaching an-expert A> A> Isn't JOUZU simply "good at" ? "You're great at teaching, Youji-san." ? P> P> yah - it's good at. how good, expert or great, or whatever i dunno. I'll leave this. --------------------------------------------------- A> 93-2 A> Jin: A> > Ah... a... A> A> Sweat-bead alert! ^_^ Again, that's on his head, not in the speech bubble. --------------------------------------------------- A> 95-4 A> > narration: A> > Oh no! ...mazui! A> > narration: A> > Before I realized it... atashi tteba itsu no mani ka A> > I I-tell-you before-one-knows A> A> She sweats in this panel, too -- though I guess it wouldn't be a A> sweat-bead. I don't think you're quite grasping what I mean by the insertions in the lines. When it's in the speech bubble or in some text it's like those heart-symbols. They add a certain meaning or slant to the spoken line. They become almost like punctuation. Thus, they have to be included in any translated line. --------------------------------------------------- P> before i even knew it, i was getting familiar/used-to that abornomal P> family. ok, that flips the bottom two sentences, but right now, as P> good as it is, just doesn't work :) A> A> Yeah, I gotta agree with Paul here... Ah, keep your pants on. ^_^ It's just a tense tweak that's gotta be done... ===> 95-4 narration: Before I even knew it... atashi tteba itsu no mani ka I I-tell-you before-one-knows 5 narration: That abnormal family is ano IJOU na KAZOKU ni something... that abnormal family to Miki: [off] (...I'm getting used to!!) (najinde-shimatte-iru!!) am-growing-accustomed-to-(finality) --------------------------------------------------- P> > 96-1 P> > Miki: P> > (I totally screwed up!!) (ZETTAI mazui!!) P> > absoluteness unwise P> P> mazui is more like unwise rather than a 'mistake' per se. A> A> I think this is more like "This is absolutely terrible!" A> or something like that... P> P> the aboslutely comes from zettai. but as for mazui, yah - terrible or P> bad occurence. i guess mistake works Within the limits of , I think "messed up" or "screwed up" is the best line to come out of Miki's mouth. --------------------------------------------------- P> > 96-3 P> > Miki: P> > I won't poke my nose KAREra no koto ni P> > into their affairs... into-their-affairs P> > P> > KUCHI DAshi wa shinai P> > poke-one's-nose-into (T) not-do P> P> affairs but 96-3 P> > Don't count me as part of kedo atashi wa NAKAMA ni wa P> > that group! but I (T) in-a-company (contrast) P> > P> > hainnai! P> > not-include P> P> but i wont join in their group A> A> I'd put the "but" in the second part -- I like Paul's suggestion. The is definitely grouped in the 2nd section in the speech bubble. ===> 96-3 Miki: I won't poke my nose KAREra no koto ni into their affairs... into-their-affairs KUCHI DAshi wa shinai poke-one's-nose-into (T) not-do But I won't join in their kedo atashi wa NAKAMA ni wa company! but I (T) in-a-company (contrast) hainnai! not-include --------------------------------------------------- 96-4 Meiko: You can be friendly and sonna koto iwazu ni leave something like that that-kind-of-thing tacitly unsaid... NAKA yoku yareba ii no ni... on-good-terms if-do okay even-though P> P> close :) rather than saying that kind of thing, it'd be better if you P> were to just join in friendly. A> A> Sure. Except I think it'd have to be "friendlily" or something then. A> How about "friendly-like" instead? Ugh. I'm sticking to "can be friendly." ===> 96-4 Meiko: Rather than saying that sonna koto iwazu ni kind of thing, you can be that-kind-of-thing tacitly friendly. NAKA yoku yareba ii no ni... on-good-terms if-do okay even-though --------------------------------------------------- A> 97-4 A> > I can't buy anything decent hitori ja A> > by myself, can I?! by-oneself-(T) A> > ____ A> > roku na mono KAenai desho?! A> > -good-thing poss-can't-buy A> > A> > Therefore... da kara... A> A> I think "So..." would be more appropriate at the end there... A> I rarely use 'therefore' in conversation... P> P> either Prefer it. --------------------------------------------------- A> 98-4 A> Miki: [brightly] A> > If it's that earring, then sono iyaringu dattara batchiri A> > it's exactly to Mama's that-earring if-it-is right-on A> > taste! ____ A> > mama no KONOmi! A> > Mama's-taste A> A> "...it's exactly Mama's taste!" No. --------------------------------------------------- P> put youtwo at the front ===> 99-3 Rumi: [strangely quiet] It's nothing. nan demo nai no yo The vase broke, that's all. KAbin ga WAreta dake vase (S) smashed/broke just You two--go to your rooms! ...anta-tachi wa HEYA ni you-(and-assoc) (T) to-rooms Itte-nasai go-(command) --------------------------------------------------- A> 100-2 A> > Yuu: A> > ...wasn't it? ja ne-- no? A> > A> > That atmosphere... ano FUN'IKI wa A> > A> > Yuu: _______ A> > ...on top of that, was shikamo soutou ken'aku A> > pretty tense. moreover pretty tense A> A> Hmm... now, "That atmosphere..." is in a printed word bubble A> while the rest of it is just handwritten in. The way you have it, A> Craig, it looks like a continuation of the same line... how about A> "Furthermore, it was pretty tense." Since "it" is the *atmosphere*, what's the difference? --------------------------------------------------- A> 101-2 A> Yuu: A> > Somehow, it seems your omae no RYOUSHIN to ore no RYOUSHIN to A> > parents and mine had a with-your-parents-and-my-parents A> > clash of opinions. A> > de nanka IKEN ga A> > because somehow opinion (S) A> > A> > TAIRITSU shita mitai A> > were-opposed seems A> A> "...had a difference of opinions." ? Same thing. Prefer as-is. --------------------------------------------------- A> I think this is "I wonder if this'll be patched up quickly..." P> P> kunnai is 'hope' - short for shite-kurenai. so 'i hope they make up P> quickly' ===> 101-4 Miki: It's sorta unpleasant, isn't nanka ya da yo ne it... somewhat unpleasant is (rhet) Being so tense at home. uchi no NAKA ga KEN'AKU na at-home (S) gloomy/tense is no tte (nom) (quote) I hope they make up soon... HAYAku NAKANAOri shite-kunnai ka naa... quickly not-make-up I-wonder --------------------------------------------------- J> >102-1 J> >Ginta: J> > ......... ......... J> > J> >2 J> >[To Ginta's surprise, Meiko speaks up beside him.] J> J> This sounds like he's surprised because she says something. I think he's J> surprised when she says something because he didn't know she was there. J> J> I suggest: [Meiko suddenly appears beside Ginta.] A> A> Sure. She didn't "suddenly appear beside him". Not necessarily. She's just *there*. And he's surprised by her speaking up when he didn't realize she was there. --------------------------------------------------- P> > 104-1 P> > Chiyako: __________ P> > Changing partners after IMAsara pa--tona-- o P> > such a long time was more after-so-long-a-time partner (O) P> > than we could handle. P> > KAeru nante MURI datta no yo P> > change the-likes-of was-impossible P> P> was indeed impossible [after all] A> A> Sure. Well, obviously. But that's a bit too clunky. And where's this "indeed" "after all" coming from? There's a "after all" in the previous sentence (from ). Anyway, I went with "was too much" for . --------------------------------------------------- J> >104-3 J> >Jin: J> > We'll cancel the shared DOUKYO wa KAISHOU shiyou J> > living arrangements. live-in-same-house (T) shall-dissolve J> J> Ok, maybe they *aren't the Stepford parents after all.... I only dimly remember "The Stepford Wives" but then I was, what, a month old at the time? ^_^ [yah, right...] --------------------------------------------------- Craig From cnishida@netcom.com Sat Oct 28 07:54:25 1995 Received: from netcom13.netcom.com by soyokaze.biosci.ohio-state.edu (8.7.1/1.950110) id HAA24764; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 07:54:23 GMT Received: by netcom13.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id AAA15045; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 00:50:15 -0700 Date: Sat, 28 Oct 1995 00:50:14 -0700 (PDT) From: "Craig H. Nishida" Subject: Re: [MB-MANGA] 1.3 (3/4) To: MB-trans ML Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Paul writes: P> On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Jeanne writes: J> On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Akira writes: A> P> I kinda hav eto do this in bits and pieces...sorry...anyway No problem at all. It's why I post in "bits and pieces". --------------------------------------------------- P> > 105-2 P> > Jin: P> > It's ended up with so much konna ni KIZU tsuke au KEKKA ni P> > hurt... this-much meet-with-injury to-outcome P> > P> > Owatte-shimatta... P> > ended-(finality) P> P> tsuke-au implies -to- hurt, or hurting each other. That's the implication I get with the sentence as-is, though. A> I guess there's a tense inconsistency, Paul? A> "It's ended up hurting this much." perhaps? IMO, too vague. --------------------------------------------------- P> i dont think 'relief' is the right word. and we haven't entered? A> A> "The only good side is that we haven't..." ? "good side"? No, I by far prefer "relief". Either way on the tense. ===> 105-3 Jin: The only relief is that mada SEKI o Irete-nakatta no ga we haven't entered the yet didn't-have-one's-name- (nom) (S) new names into our family entered-in-family-register registers yet. YUIITSU no SUKUi da na only 's salvation/relief is --------------------------------------------------- P> tamahiroi is person-who-picks-up-the-balls. Oh. ===> 105-FREE TALK How to be a ballgirl, and TAMAHIROi no shikata to ka the menu of training a-ball-retriever 's a-way and-such exercises--I'm confident I _______ can write about such things RENSHUU menyu-- to ka, with realism... training/practice menu and-such _____ riaru ni KAkeru JISHIN in-reality can-write self-confidence a n da kedo na--. ? (explan) but (rhet) --------------------------------------------------- A> 105-FREE TALK A> > Since becoming a member of SHAKAIJIN to natte kara A> > society, I chiefly take my turning-out-a-member-of-society since A> > pleasure from watching games _____ A> > on TV, scarcely having any wa, JIBUN de purei suru A> > spare time to play myself. (contrast) by-self play A> > ____ A> > hima wa hotondo naku, A> > spare-time (T) scarcely -have A> > A> > moppara #TV# KANSEN de A> > chiefly watch-a-game-on-TV A> > A> > TANOshinde-imasu. A> > am-taking-pleasure-in A> A> Is that initial bit something like "Upon entering (high) society" ? I didn't think so. Sounds like a mere "when I came of age" kinda thing. A> How about keeping the phrase order the same? A> "...I've scarcely had spare time to play myself, so I take my pleasure A> chiefly from watching games on TV." You're manufacturing a "so" in my eyes. Without the "so" it just doesn't work as well in that order in English! --------------------------------------------------- J> >105-FREE TALK J> > ______ J> > And so, in order to watch de, tenisu o MIru tame ni J> > tennis, I finally joined and-so tennis (O) watch for-the-sake-of J> > WOWOW too, but (Since J> > WOWOW's movies are subtitled tsui ni #WOWOW# ni mo KANYUU shita J> > I can't watch while working, in-the-end into-WOWOW too joined J> > so I didn't intend to J> > join, but just because of n da kedo (#WOWOW# no EIGA wa J> > tennis...) I don't have the (explan) but 's movie (T) J> > spare time to hook up the J> > deco-o-oder!! JIMAKU na no de, J> > subtitled are since J> > J> > SHIGOTO shi-nagara MIrarenai kara J> > while-working can't-watch that's-why J> > J> > KANYUU suru tsumori nakatta n da J> > join intention had-not (explan) J> > ______ J> > kedo, tenisu no tame dake ni...) J> > but tennis just-for-the-sake-of J> > __________ ____ J> > deko--da-- toritsukeru hima ga J> > decoder install/furnish spare-time (S) J> > J> > na-----i_!! J> > not-have J> J> What's "WOWOW"? A> A> I dunno... glad you asked though. (I was too embarrassed to) ^_^ >From context, it's a cable station. What it stands for is beyond me. --------------------------------------------------- J> >105-FREE TALK J> > ______ J> > Somehow, I have to hook it 1-GATSU no ZEN GOU o--pun made ni J> > up before the January 's all great Open before J> > Open in January... J> > wa nantoka toritsukenakya... J> > (contrast) somehow must-install J> > J> > J> > J> > > here. The kanji characters are = "all" (the same in J> > and ) and = "great/powerful/excelling".> J> J> Maybe Yoshizumi-san's talking about the Australian Open? That's a major J> tennis tournament (part of the Grand Slam (along with the French Open, J> Wimbledon, and the US Open)), and it's in January... A> A> Yeah, if it's in January, probably. That already occurred to me. But why isn't it ? --------------------------------------------------- A> 106-3 A> narration: A> > Why did it suddenly nande ikinari so-- yu-- koto ni A> > turn out that way?! why suddenly to-that-kind-of-thing A> > A> > natchatta wake?! A> > became-(finality) reason A> A> "...turn out like this?!" A> ...at any rate, replace the "that" with "this"... Err. = *that* kind of --------------------------------------------------- A> I think the "kara..." here merits an appended "so..." : A> "Koishikawas, so..." ===> 106-5 Chiyako: I'm sorry, Yuu. gomen ne YUU It would be better if we KOISHIKAWA-san to no SETTEN wa severed all contact with with-Koishikawa (nom) contact-point (T) the Koishikawas, so... nakushita HOU ga ii kara... did-away-with better that's-why --------------------------------------------------- A> 108-1 A> Miki: [earnestly] A> > Is it all right to simply sonna kantan ni KETSURON A> > come to a conclusion like like-that simply a-conclusion A> > that?! A> > DAshichatte ii no?! A> > turning-out-(finality) okay A> A> Considering what she says in the next line, perhaps "jump to a conclusion" A> would be a good substitution for "come to a conclusion" ? I dunno. I don't think that's really necessary. --------------------------------------------------- P> > 108-1 P> > Don't you feel any regret?! KOUKAI shinai?! P> > not-feel-regret P> P> won't you regret it A> A> I figured it was something like "Don't you have any lingering doubts?" A> Of the other two, I prefer Craig's by a sliver... seems to work in better A> with the lines before... Yes, I prefer it as-is. --------------------------------------------------- P> it'll be the way you've [always] wantd it to be A> A> Yeah. ===> 108-2 Rumi: What's the matter, Miki...? ...dou shita no MIKI You were so opposed to this. anta anna ni HANTAI shite-ta ja nai you that-much were-opposed Jin: It'll be the way you've omae no NOZOnde-ta TOOri ni naru always wanted it to be!! you (nom) were-hoping become-the-way n da zo (explan) !! Aren't you happy? ureshikunai no ka? --------------------------------------------------- A> 108-4 A> Miki: A> > So I was beginning to think kekkou umaku yatte-ike A> > that maybe it looked like quite go-and-manage-successfully A> > this would work out pretty A> > well... -sou ka na tte A> > look-as-if I-wonder (quote) A> > A> > OMOi hajimete-ta...... A> > a-thought was-beginning A> A> Maybe this is just the latitude speaking, but I'd strongly prefer A> "...that it looked like maybe this would work out okay..." A> I mean, she's talking about how "maybe things would work out", A> instead of "maybe it looks promising". Having the "maybe" in front A> of the "it looked like" shifts the uncertainty from the weird relationship A> to her perceptions about it. And I think the uncertainty is about the A> relationship. I don't agree. A> I'd also strongly prefer a neutral word such as "okay" or "alright" A> to "pretty well" -- I can't see her imagining things'd turn out pretty well A> but I can imagine her seeing them as turning out okay. Err. Miki has already stated that she's seen that the four are getting along like they were old and dear friends. "Okay" is way too dilute. --------------------------------------------------- P> changing your feelings, not feelings have changed, so to speak. ===> 109-1 Miki: [off] And yet, everyone simply na no ni minna konna changed their feelings like is even-though everyone like-this this... kantan ni KIMOchi KAechatte simply feelings change-(and) --------------------------------------------------- P> although it was but for a short while... Hey, that sounds pretty good. But how do you string in the rest? Does "...during which we were getting along well together, to completely cut all ties like that..." work? J> I suggest: "Even though we were getting along together for a short while, J> to completely cut all ties like that..." This doesn't quite incorporate that . A> Hmm... maybe something like A> "It's only been a short while, but we were getting along together. A> To completely cut all ties like this..." ? A> I don't think the "even though" fits into the sentence right. A> "considering that we were..." would be an apt substitution if you wanted A> to include the "no ni". I don't see any need to drop it, though. ===> 109-1 Although it was but for a MIJIKAi AIDA da kedo short while during which short/brief interval is but we were getting along well together, to completely issho ni KUrashite-ta no ni cut all ties like that... together were-getting-along even-though MATTAku EN KItchau completely cut-connections-(finality) nante sonna no...... the-likes-of like-that (nom) --------------------------------------------------- J> >109-2 J> >Jin: J> > Then, you aren't sore ja omae wa IMA no SEIKATSU ni J> > dissatisfied with life then you (T) now 's by-life J> > as it is right now? J> > FUMAN wa nai n da na? J> > aren't-dissatisfied (explan) (rhet) J> > J> J> I suggest: "Then you aren't dissatisfied with your life right now?" A> A> Sure. To me, "your life" puts the spin on Miki's life, when it's more a matter of how her parents are living--or maybe, the family's life?--that bothers her. --------------------------------------------------- A> For some reason I think the "da na" means that Jin is trying A> to confirm that the current situation is OK. The line's totally A> different, but I got the impression the gist of what he was saying was A> "So that means it's alright that this continues forever, doesn't it?" A> Any way to add affirmation to the sentence? A> "It's okay, then, if this continues, forever?" Ack, what's with all the commas? It's just a rhetorical ending, if you like. "...hm?" or "...right?" or "...then" ===> 109-4 Jin: [off] Is it okay if this continues zutto kono mama de forever, then? all-the-time if-this-goes-on ii n da na? okay (explan) Would that be better? sono HOU ga ii n da na? that better (explan) --------------------------------------------------- P> > 109-4 P> > narration: P> > This is sorta beside the nanka RONTEN ga zurete---- P> > point... somewhat beside-the-point P> P> somehow we missed the point, or got off trac A> A> Either. Tweaked since it's Miki's pov. ===> 109-4 narration: Somehow, I'm missing the nanka RONTEN ga zurete---- point... somewhat beside-the-point --------------------------------------------------- P> It's not a song. He's just quoting what he thought when he lsitened to P> that cd A> A> I think this is: A> "When I listened to it, there were a lot of "Gee I'd forgotten about it, A> but there was a song that went like this, wasn't there -- I used to A> like this a lot" songs, which totally filled me with nostalgia. ===> 109-FREE TALK When I listened to it, it KIite-mitara, "sukkari WASUrete-ta was full of songs that when-try-to-listen quite-forgot made me think, "I'd quite forgotten it, but there kedo ko-- yu-- UTA atta na-- were songs like these, but that-kind-of-song there-as (rhet) weren't there, that I used to like a lot," and I was kore suggoku SUki datta kke" to iu completely filled with this awfully was-liked (?) called nostalgia. KYOKU ga ippai atte tottemo music (S) full-of have-(and) utterly natsukashikatta. was-feeling-nostalgic --------------------------------------------------- A> "Among those songs was one piece called..." ===> 109-FREE TALK Among those songs was a sou iu KYOKU no NAKA no piece called "Wounded that-kind-of-music 's insides 's Generation," and this is, sort of, a song that sounds hitotsu ni "KIZUtsuku SEDAI" like it's about Miki and partly be-wounded a-generation Yuu. to iu no ga atte, kore ga called (nom) (S) there-is-(and) this (S) ne, nanka, MIKI to YUU no koto (rhet) somewhat about-Miki-and-Yuu UTAtte-ru mitai na KYOKU na no. are-singing seems music is --------------------------------------------------- P> the 'pittari' is in reference to how appropriate that song-title (wounded P> whatever) is. WHe you put it in quotes like that, it makes it sound like P> another song he's comparing it to ===> 109-FREE TALK It's not quite "perfect!!", "pittari!!" to made wa but it's pretty close. perfect (quote) as-far-as (contrast) ikanai kedo, kanari CHIKAi. not-go but pretty-close --------------------------------------------------- P> i became happy A> A> Sure. ===> 109-FREE TALK _______ _____ Somehow, it seems I came nan da ka ime--ji songu MItsuketa across an image song, and somehow image-song noticed I became happy. mitai de ureshiku natchaimashita. seem-(and) became-glad-(finality) --------------------------------------------------- A> "If you just hear the title, you'd get the impression it was A> intense, but it's not like that." ? I don't like that as much. I'll just tweak the original line. ===> 109-FREE TALK _______ If all you hear is the taitoru dake KIku to nanka title, you'd just get the title only if-hear somewhat feeling like it was sorta intense, and it's not like HAGEshi -sou na kanji that. intense/furious look-as-if feeling dake de, sou demo nai yo. just be-(and) not-like-that --------------------------------------------------- Craig From cnishida@netcom.com Sat Oct 28 20:45:05 1995 Received: from netcom12.netcom.com by soyokaze.biosci.ohio-state.edu (8.7.1/1.950110) id UAA25204; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 20:45:02 GMT Received: by netcom12.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id NAA27237; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 13:40:42 -0700 Date: Sat, 28 Oct 1995 13:40:42 -0700 (PDT) From: "Craig H. Nishida" Subject: Re: [MB-MANGA] 1.3 (4/4) To: MB-trans ML Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I guess I'll "close the books" on chapter 1.2 in a week or so. On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Paul writes: P> On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Jeanne writes: J> On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Akira writes: A> On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Scott writes: S> 110-3 Youji: We were worried over MIKI-chan ga honto ni kono SEIKATSU o whether or not you had (S) really this-life (O) really accepted this life, Miki-chan, so we put on a UkeIrete-kureta no ka dou ka play. accepted-(us) (nom) if/whether SHIMPAI datta n de HITO SHIBAI was-worried 'cause one play/drama utta n da put-on (explan) A> A> I'd use "we put on an act" instead. A> A> 110-4 A> Miki: A> > A play...? SHIBAI...? A> A> Again, I think we'd usually use "act" here... A> e.g. "It was all an act?" Ordinarily, I'd readily agree, except that Jin and Rumi are waving around their scriptbooks. So I did it as "a play". --------------------------------------------------- P> there's no reason for us to fight A> A> Sure. Just re-word it so "fighting" becomes "fight" ===> 110-4 Rumi: [off] That's right. We're sorry. sou na no gomen ne-- _____ We have no reason to WATASHI-tachi ga kenka nante suru fight. we (S) fight-and-such wake nai wa yo have-no-reason It's going so well. konna ni umaku itte-ru no ni this-much is-succeeding/going-well even-tho --------------------------------------------------- P> sort of ===> 111-2 Yuu: Sort of... nanto naku ne... ______ What you were saying Itte-ru koto ga serifu-ppokatta sounded like actor's are-saying (nom) (S) was-like-lines lines... shi and-besides --------------------------------------------------- A> 111-2 A> Jin: A> > How sharp, Yuu-kun. surudoi na-- YUU-kun A> A> "You're sharp..." ? = rhetorical --------------------------------------------------- P> it was like being an actress [and so] it was fun ===> 111-3 Chiyako: [off] It was like being an JOYUU ni natta mitai de actress, and that was fun. became-actress seem-(and) TANOshikatta wa-- was-pleasant --------------------------------------------------- P> > 111-3 P> > Youji: [off] P> > But that vase was a waste. demo ano KAbin mottainakatta na P> > but that-vase was-wasteful P> > ______ P> > The glass that was broken KYOU WAtta gurasu mo... P> > today, too... today broke glass too P> P> and that glass that was broken today too Either. ===> 111-3 Youji: [off] But that vase was a waste. demo ano KAbin mottainakatta na but that-vase was-wasteful ______ And that glass that was KYOU WAtta gurasu mo... broken today, too... today broke glass too --------------------------------------------------- A> 112-6 A> > Jin: A> > We ticked her off KANZEN ni OKOrasete-shimatta... A> > completely... thoroughly made-angry-(finality) A> > A> > Chiyako: A> > We overdid it a bit, huh. chotto yari-sugita wa ne A> > a-bit over-done (rhet) A> A> I'd drop the second "we"... sounds a bit repetitive... Nah. --------------------------------------------------- A> 112-6 A> Youji: A> > That's why I told you da kara ore yameta HOU ga ii A> > we'd better stop. and-so I quit better A> > A> > tte Itta no ni A> > (quote) told even-though A> A> "That's why I told you we should've stopped." ? No. --------------------------------------------------- P> > 112-6 P> > Rumi: P> > It's too late to say that. IMA sara sore wa P> > when-it-is-too-late that (T) P> > P> > iikkonashi yo P> > expression P> P> iikkonashi is 'no saying' sorta. ie: there's no saying that allowed here P> at this late time Err. That doesn't make much sense in English. The dictionary listing I have for says, see = (a-turn-of)-expression; diction. As in = a- clumsy-expression. If, what you mean is "That's nothing to say at this late time" then I'd have to strongly lean towards the original line. --------------------------------------------------- P> that's it. i'm leaving. house like this ===> 113-1 Miki: [off] (That's it. I'm leaving!! (mo---- ya da DEru!! konna IE!! A house like this!! grrrrr unpleasant come-out home- like-this --------------------------------------------------- P> > 113-2 P> > Miki: ____ P> > (But that isn't possible (demo IMA sugu wa muri da... P> > right now... but right-away (T) impossible is P> > P> > It's too bad, but I don't kuyashi-- kedo o-KANE nai shi P> > have the money... regrettable but money not-have consider P> P> kuyashii is stronger than regrettable. There's "regrettable" and there's "regrettable". probably falls on the upper scale. A> Woefully? Lamentably? "Tragically, I don't have the money..."? Err. Sounds a little contrived perhaps. It's either the original or this for me: ===> 113-2 Miki: ____ (But that isn't possible (demo IMA sugu wa muri da... right now... but right-away (T) impossible is It's a shame, but I don't kuyashi-- kedo o-KANE nai shi have the money... regrettable but money not-have consider --------------------------------------------------- P> i won't let them complain. i'll even get an allowance out of them ===> 113-2 Miki: (I won't let them complain. (MONKU nanka Iwasenai complaint or-such not-let-say I'll even get an allowance SHIOKUri datte moratte-yaru! out of them! allowance even get-(from-them) --------------------------------------------------- A> 114-4 A> Miki: A> > You'd be seriously injured Ochitara OOkega da yo!! A> > if you fell!! if-fall serious-injury is A> A> "If you fell you'd be seriously injured!!" ? Prefer as-is. A> "You were so surprised, the tears stopped." It does need a "so", but not like that, I think: ===> 114-4 Yuu: ha ha_ You were surprised, so the bikkuri shite NAMIDA tomattaro tears stopped. surprise-(and) tears poss-stopped --------------------------------------------------- P> this time...just now is too 'soon' Yah, but "this time" to me implies there were other times, and not a reference to a recent time. So, "just then"? I suppose "back then" is too "late". ===> 115-1 Yuu: That was a bit too cruel... ...chotto hido-sugiru yo naa a-bit too-cruel (rhet) Just then. KONKAI no wa --------------------------------------------------- A> 115-3 A> Yuu: A> > ...you're tested with a uso de TAMEsaretari shitara A> > lie... with-lie when-are-tested-(and) A> > A> > ...you get hurt. KIZUtsuichau yo na... A> A> "If you're tested..." ? (To include the 'shitara') Err, no. This connects from the previous line in 115-2. "Whenever..." --------------------------------------------------- P> even if it took such extreme measures like this [one they used here]... P> they wanted to make.. "extreme"? How about just: ===> 116-1 Yuu: Even if it took using konna yariKATA o TSUKAtte demo measures like this... like-this how-to-do (O) using even-if They wanted to make sure MIKI ni kirawarete-nai tte koto that you didn't dislike by-Miki not-be-disliked (quote) (nom) them, Miki. TASHIkametakatta n da yo wanted-to-make-sure (explan) --------------------------------------------------- J> >117-2 J> >narration: J> > Just teasing me... karakatte bakari no kuse ni J> > making-fun-of only although J> J> I suggest: "making fun of me" A> A> Being the ambivalent Canadian that I am, I'll go either way on this. ^_^ I can't think of anything Yuu's done that would qualify as "making fun of"--which, to me, seems a level above "teasing". --------------------------------------------------- J> >117-3 J> >[A backdrop of flowers.] J> >narration: J> > When he's so sincerely sonna ni majime ni YASAshiku saretara J> > sweet to me... that-much earnestly when-is-sweet-to-me J> J> I suggest: "When he's so sweet" A> A> I actually prefer it with the sincerely there... The is there. --------------------------------------------------- P> doushite ii ka - is dunno what to do Oh, I see it now. A> Perhaps it's a contraction of "dou sureba ii" ? A> "I end up not knowing what the best course of action would be." ? A> ...or some paraphrase thereof? "course of action" is ranging pretty far afield. Maybe just keep it as = okay-to-do, should-do, can-do ===> 117-3 narration: I end up not knowing what dou shite ii ka wakannaku natchau yo... I should do... what should- (?) become-not- do knowing-(finality) --------------------------------------------------- J> >118-2 J> >Rumi: J> > Miki! MIKI! J> > J> >Chiyako: J> > Miki-chan, we're sorry... MIKI-chan gomen ne WATASHI-tachi... J> > sorry we J> J> Isn't this Rumi and Jin? Has Jin ever called his daughter, "Miki-chan"? I've only seen Chiyako and Youji do it. As I recall, anyway... --------------------------------------------------- J> >118-3 J> > But... sono kawari J> > J> >Miki: J> > You're getting me my ashita no YUUSHOKU wa atashi no J> > favorite dish for dinner tomorrow 's dinner (T) my J> > tomorrow. J> > SUki na MONO soroete yo ne J> > favorite-thing arranging/getting-ready J> J> I suggest: "You're making me my favorite dish for tomorrow's dinner." A> A> Either. S> S> Knowing Miki's opinion of her mother's cooking, I think "making" is S> the last thing she wants... I think the line is good as is. Not only do I agree with Scott and the original line, but I'm pretty sure there's a specific way for saying "prepare me (a dish)". You'd probably use and not . --------------------------------------------------- A> "was an unpleasant thought." Whups. ===> 119-1 narration: ...that I'd never be able NIDO to Aenaku naru nante to see Yuu again was an never-able-to-meet become the-likes-of unpleasant thought. iya da to OMOtta is-unpleasant thought-that --------------------------------------------------- Craig